Holy crap the E46 is cheap

"JR1" (type35bugatti) 01/21/2016 at 11:08 • Filed to: E46, 3 series, bmw

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I am casually shopping around for a new car to replace my truck (better gas milage). One of the top candidates right now is a Cadillac STS but suddenly a E46 coupe seems quite applying. Anyone have any experience with these? How bad is the maintenance on them?

http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/…

http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/…

http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/…

Aaron M - MasoFiST > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:12

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Make sure you have the rear subframe inspected. The subframe cracking is less of an issue in both the newer cars and the lower-power ones, but none are immune.

Check over the cooling system, there are issues with the fan and others, and generally the fan, water pump and hoses should be done around 100k.

d15b > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:14

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Wow, that is cheap.

FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:14

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I got bitten by the bug a looong time ago.

JR1 > d15b 01/21/2016 at 11:14

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I know it is crazy! It makes me think they must be maintenance nightmares or something

Noah - Now with more boost. > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:16

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They’re essentially a more advanced E36, which I have plenty of experience working on. BMWs from that era are full of expensive plastic parts that break but the drivetrains are pretty reliable. Maintenance isn’t cheap but it isn’t difficult either. I’ve driven an auto 330i, which was a lot of fun. The steering was still tight after 100K. Definitely get a 330, there’s absolutely no reason to buy a 325 and they’re very slow. I think they’re cheap because of age + the Takata airbag recall. I was considering an M/T 330i but I didn’t want to deal with sketchy recall issues.

d15b > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:18

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It’s at “Early 90s Honda” cheap. That is pretty damn cheap. I think you have to replace the radiator every once in a while because they are made of plastic.

Any BMW-phile want to elaborate?

Noah - Now with more boost. > FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem 01/21/2016 at 11:18

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mmmm style 32s! tasty.

JR1 > FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem 01/21/2016 at 11:20

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These are such beautiful cars.

Party-vi > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:20

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“How bad is the maintenance on them?”

FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem > Noah - Now with more boost. 01/21/2016 at 11:22

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One of the few oem wheels that don’t look out of place on multiple generations of cars.

FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:23

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They really are.

Party-vi > Noah - Now with more boost. 01/21/2016 at 11:23

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Any BMW dealer will replace the airbags without issue or cost. The passenger airbag parts were received last year, but they are still waiting for the driver airbags.

Needmoargarage > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 11:25

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Came here to page you. And/or post this .

Rico > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:25

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Someone here posted the other day how they sold theirs which was properly maintained with new brakes for like $4500. It’s a 15 year old car with a shitload of maintenance, I wouldn’t expect them to be very expensive at all.

Party-vi > d15b 01/21/2016 at 11:26

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If you buy one of these with no service records you’ll need the following:

Replace water pump; original was plastic and broke a lot

Replace expansion tank; tank is plastic and broke a lot

Replace HVAC resistor; original is shitty and broke a lot

Replace pillar covers; originals are shitty and came off a lot

Replace valve cover gasket; original is shitty and leaked a lot

Replace auto transmission fluid; BMW refuses to service the ATs on the E46, so that fluid in there is as old as the car.

Party-vi > Needmoargarage 01/21/2016 at 11:27

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I should link all my E46 woe-is-me posts to his quote.

d15b > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 11:29

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I had no idea.

Jobjoris > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:31

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I have no experience with the 3.0 with over 150k kms but up then it never failed me (in a Z4, same M54B30). “Ze Germans” call that 3.0 “Ein richtiger Bauern Motor” for a reason, the engine is bullet proof if maintained properly.

You need the 3.0 anyway, you want that 6-speed!

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 11:31

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That all seems relatively straightforward work for a home garage wrencher. Unless BMW requires you to pull the engine like a Porsche to do...anything.

How much cost is involved with your list (appx)?

Party-vi > d15b 01/21/2016 at 11:32

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For all it’s issues and maintenance requirements, the E46 is an amazing car to drive. Perfect steering feel, amazing handling, excellent acceleration feel, a great exhaust note, and the HK speakers are a good option to have. Plus, turning on the lights and watching them adjust up and then level is neato.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:34

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In my home town right now, there is an E30 four door in good condition body-wise, which may need a trans job down the line but is currently driving: $900 OBO. If you think the E46 is cheap...

Noah - Now with more boost. > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 11:34

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Exactly. I didn’t want to drive something dangerous while I wait for the parts. Though I’d consider a 330 once a full replacement is possible.

Needmoargarage > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 11:36

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I’ve absolutely loved driving every BMW I’ve owned up until the first thing goes wrong. Then it’s domino effect.

functionoverfashion > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:38

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I’ve had 2 E46s, both 325xi wagons, both manual.

I read through the bimmerfest forum a lot before getting mine, and I learned what to look out for, and what maintenance items to group together. Like, I made sure to replace most of the plastic parts of the cooling system all together. It’s only a few hundred bucks to do yourself, and the work is generally straightforward. I did the CCV / PCV myself and it was about $150 in parts and a few hours of my time. That’s one of the harder things to do, and it wasn’t terrible. I’ve never had to remove the whole front bumper to access some simple part, or anything like that. Side note: I’d never done all my own work prior to owning the ‘01 wagon. I read my Bentley manual and the forums, and it was easy to learn.

I’ve been keeping track of the maintenance on my E46s for 7 years now, and I’d budget around $500 - $1000 a year to really stay ahead of any issues you might have, and to allow for something unexpected if you have to pay for labor especially. My ‘03 was in much nicer shape than my ‘01 ever was, and it’s been a bit better on maintenance; it’s also lower mileage. You might spend less, but I said “budget.” Doesn’t everyone like to be under budget if possible? I know I’ve spent more in some years, but way less in others.

Overall, the entry price point is so low, you’ll spend less on maintenance and insurance (and registration/taxes) than just the monthly payment on a newer car. And they’re way better to drive than something you could get for $200/mo new.

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > JR1 01/21/2016 at 11:45

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Cheap used German cars

Party-vi > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind 01/21/2016 at 11:52

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I think more people have made it to the summit of Mt. Everest than those that have bled an E46 properly. This is probably a fact.

With BMW repairs you have the option to use BMW parts or aftermarket brand parts. I get BMW brand parts for the hard-to-do stuff and aftermarket bits for easy jobs.

I will tell you that BMW of Catonsville (excellent service btw) in Maryland wanted to charge me $1,600 to replace the expansion tank, thermostat, cap, heater control valve, radiator hoses, and lower radiator hose sensor. I picked up those parts for around $250 total. To replace the engine oil filter housing gasket (common leak) it’s $850, post-cat O2 sensors (2) are $980, rear main seal is $1,400, the oil pan gasket (common leak) is $1,065, and they wanted $615 for each front control arm, $670 for rear brakes/rotors, and a whooping $840 for rear shocks. It’s almost certainly less expensive to get work done at an independent shop vs. a BMW dealer, but for fluid changes you usually get a loaner from BMW. My indie charged me $380 to exchange transmission fluid because BMW trans fluid is expensive as hell.

I did my own control arms for $350 in parts, and rear shocks for $250 IIRC. I paid $500 for a complete set of brakes (front and rear pads/rotors) that I can easily do myself, etc.

Santiago of Escuderia Boricua > Noah - Now with more boost. 01/21/2016 at 12:18

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It’s not. The failure rate is like .001% or something

unclevanos (Ovaltine Jenkins) > JR1 01/21/2016 at 12:38

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If I can keep an e38 alive anybody can keep with the maintenance on a e46.

RallyWrench > Noah - Now with more boost. 01/21/2016 at 13:26

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Unless you’re in the US and want a manual wagon, in which case you’re stuck with the 325. Like mine.

marshknute > JR1 01/21/2016 at 13:42

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I remember when I used to think that as well. Then I made the mistake of buying one.

I was spending $1400 every month in maintenance. I finally traded it in after getting quoted at $4200 to repair the window motors, heater, oil leak, and cracked suspension coils (all of which broke simultaneously)

The E46 is a fucking garbage POS.

marshknute > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 13:46

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“If you buy one of these with no service records...”

No, you will have to replace ALL of those things regardless of service records. All the service records do is give you a handy cheat-sheet so you know how buttfucked your wallet is going to be.

RallyWrench > JR1 01/21/2016 at 13:54

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More or less the last real DIY-friendly BMW. My ‘03 wagon has 160k and runs like a train. I’ve had to replace the valve cover and intake flap while I’ve had it, but otherwise it’s just been maintenance. I did buy a known quantity, the car belonged to a friend and was well cared for at the shop I run. Mine’s a manual and will need a clutch soon, but the automatics rarely last past 150k.

All the plastic in the cooling system should be done before 100k, and if it’s ever been overheated that can drastically reduce the life of the head. Stuff like window regulators and blower regulators are common failures, but are easily fixed. If the Xenon headlamp ballasts go it can get a bit spendy, but that’s not too common. The serpentine belt rollers are made of plastic and go bad all the time, but are also easy to fix. The oil filter housing commonly leaks at its base, and the plastic valve covers leak regularly as well, sometimes requiring replacement of the cover itself, which is a $400 part. The front control arm bushings are weak, they’re a poor design, but it’s a very easy thing to fix.

If they’re not looked after or abused they can be money pits to a certain extent, but by and large I defend them as the last good BMW. I say that because you used to be able to buy a BMW and reasonably expect over 200k miles on regular maintenance, without huge expenditure for failures. Those days are gone, and they ended with the E60, 65, and 90. People will inevitably chime in with exceptions, but in my professional experience it’s true.

JR1 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 14:01

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You are crushing my dreams man.

JR1 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 14:02

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Now the question becomes even with the maintenance would you do it again?

JR1 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 14:03

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Once those are replaced though is it a continual problem of is it remedied?

JR1 > functionoverfashion 01/21/2016 at 14:07

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Coming from a truck that maybe you have to spend $250 a year for max on maintenance $500/$1000 seems like a lot.

JR1 > RallyWrench 01/21/2016 at 14:08

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So how much do you spend a year in maintenance then? Like $500? Assuming you DIY

JR1 > V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches 01/21/2016 at 14:09

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You are the crazy one who had to have a V12 Merc

JR1 > Jobjoris 01/21/2016 at 14:10

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That is good. 150km is what about 90,000 miles?

JR1 > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 01/21/2016 at 14:11

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Cheaper than expected. But $900 is a down right steal

ciscokidinsf > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:25

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That was me who sold his for $4500- pricing will depend on year and mileage. The 330 is the most reliable BMW car according to the car data available. But it will require refreshes of coolant system every 30K miles. Other common issues are mentioned below

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/sold-my-e46-no…

Party-vi > marshknute 01/21/2016 at 14:26

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The last trip I took to the dealer they pulled up my key read sheet and had all the warranty claims on my car from when it was new. Paaaaaaaaages of shit they replaced under warranty. It was nuts.

Party-vi > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:26

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This is my job.

Party-vi > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:28

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If I were to do it again, I would have bought it from a more reputable dealer, and I would have purchased it for $1,000 - $2,000 less than their sticker price. It is truly a fantastic car, but you need to have money funneled away for repairs.

Party-vi > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:29

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water pump and thermostat should be done every 60,000 miles, plugs and transmission too. HVAC resistor might be once every two years (and it’s a bitch to do). Pillar covers are cosmetic. I put around 22k or 25k miles on my car each year, so this tends to get quite expensive for me.

Jobjoris > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:32

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Over 90k. You definitely should check one out.

RallyWrench > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:45

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I do all my own work, and run a shop so it’s parts cost only. I’ve probably got $5-700 into it last year in parts and basic service items, including the aforementioned valve cover and manifold flap mechanism.

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > JR1 01/21/2016 at 14:45

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Yep, and it's been completely reliable and cheap to own... But seriously, if you do your homework and find a good one, it shouldn't be that bad. Or, just buy a W220 .

BlackberryShawtyHasAnE46 > JR1 01/21/2016 at 15:57

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Don’t listen to the hate. I love my e46 330ci. It’s had a few minor issues over the year I’ve owned it but like all of those were totally my fault (I crashed it... oops) and when you get in to drive it it makes it all worth it. Though I would definitely recommend a thorough pre purchase inspection before buying.

BlackberryShawtyHasAnE46 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 15:58

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I love watching the xenons in my car do the leveling thingy when I cut it on at night it’s so neat

JR1 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 16:17

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That's understandable you drive a shit ton

JR1 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 16:18

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That's unfortunate. I imagine it is a blast to drive

JR1 > Jobjoris 01/21/2016 at 16:19

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Thanks for the tip

Party-vi > JR1 01/21/2016 at 16:22

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It pulls and pulls. Rolling on the throttle between 2k - 3k rpm is just the best. It always has enough power.

JR1 > RallyWrench 01/21/2016 at 16:51

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Hmmm car is below budget but that cost for repairs might be too rich for my blood

JR1 > V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches 01/21/2016 at 16:52

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I imagine they are awesome if you get a warranty for the parts that fail. But honestly it is a goal of mine to one day DD a V12. But first I need a big boy job

JR1 > BlackberryShawtyHasAnE46 01/21/2016 at 16:53

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I noticed the convertibles are often cheaper than the coupes is there a reason for that

BlackberryShawtyHasAnE46 > JR1 01/21/2016 at 17:04

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I think that really depends on where you live. Here in Georgia they tend to be more expensive than coupes. But I mean beyond that with a power convertible top come more parts that could break so maybe that has something to do with it. But I think the price might just be a regional thing.

JR1 > Party-vi 01/21/2016 at 17:25

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Pretty neutral handling too right?

V12 Jake- Hittin' Switches > JR1 01/21/2016 at 17:26

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The non V12 W220s aren’t that bad, and cheaper to get into . I heard someone say that the V12s are for idiots or fanatics.

JR1 > BlackberryShawtyHasAnE46 01/21/2016 at 17:26

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Probably true. More warm weather means more reason to enjoy the sun

finn's arm > JR1 01/21/2016 at 18:19

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Heh. Still relatively easier on the wallet in comparison to E39s & E38s. E36s are the best imo.

Perspective: 4 aluminum control arms for an I6 E39 run $400 in just parts. The 18 piece set is $1100. Gotta get that value pack, right?

JR1 > finn's arm 01/21/2016 at 18:44

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Yikes. But then again how often does one has to replace control arms? Not very

Party-vi > JR1 01/21/2016 at 19:09

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Very good handling, and in my experience great lift-off oversteer when you want it.

911e46z06 > JR1 01/22/2016 at 00:06

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I have had exactly 1 problem with my e46 m3 in 3 years of ownership. It left me stranded, but it ended up being some sort of relay that cost $25 to fix.

I had my trusty bmw mech check out like 7 or 8 dogs before I finally found a good one though. So that’s the trick. Make sure you get a good one. My brother had a 328 sedan that was nothing but trouble.

JR1 > 911e46z06 01/22/2016 at 09:03

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Is the M3 engine significantly different than the 328? I imagine they are not the same

finn's arm > JR1 01/22/2016 at 10:57

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30-100K miles? It’s not the control arm itself, but the bushing that requires the replacement.

It’s almost impossible to take the bushings out of them and replace with delrin ones (For $200-300 (No clue why when Honda ones are like $40 for a full set) which are the only ones available). Paying shop labor to do it which would invariably cost as much as buying a full set of control arms.

finn's arm > JR1 01/22/2016 at 11:56

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Yes, there are significant differences. I also vote that you look for an M54B30 - it shares a lot with the NA S52 M3 engine out of the E36 (Crank, cams & pistons). Bore & stroke = S52B30. It’s 85% of the fun w/o a lot of the costs.

Valve (Solid finger lifters v. hydraulic self adjusting in the M54) & ITB adjustments are two prominent items that are on the S54's maintenance sheet that aren’t on the M54's. .4L bigger and more room until you hit redline.

The S54 has a lot of tech added in, but feels old school. The S54 was built on the back of the S50 which is closer to the M50NV (Most fun & reliable BMW engine ever) from 1990 than any other engine in between. When VANOS kicks in (yo), it kicks hard.

BMW developed a lot of changes in short succession for the consumer tier engines. (M50NV, M50TU, M52, M52TU and M54.) Biggest difference between my M52's (M52 & M52TU) is DISA, which variably lengthens/shortens the intake and magically adds torque down low. It just makes the car feel so modern.

911e46z06 > JR1 01/22/2016 at 13:19

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Yeah, way different. They both have the subframe issue, but other than that they’re pretty much completely different cars. The point I was trying to make is that any BMW needs to be gone over with a fine-toothed comb before you buy it.